The influence of school and its impact on an adult's life

[George 1978]

Something that really baffles me are parents who are very pro school but anti education. They want their children to attend school; they will not consider home education or alternative provisions - such as vocational courses at college instead of GCSEs; but they are not interested in their children excelling academically. In fact they often take action to deliberately hold back their children's academic attainment.

My own philosophy is similar in that I believe that education is more important than school - they are not one and the same, and I see it something a bit like this: A) education is all around us and not just in a school environment, and: B) education is more important than school - i.e. when one leaves school around the age of 16 (or 15 years, six months, and 15 days in my case), one does not necessarily leave education. Organisations like Education Otherwise where they say that "education is essential, but school is optional" would almost certainly agree with that. School and education are indeed two different beasts.

Also, based on my own stint as a "prisoner" in the education system, from experience I have found that it is better to be a school refuser than to be a truant, and the problem in my day was that Education Welfare Officers used to regard school refusal and truancy as being one and the same thing. They possibly see it a bit like "flammable" and "inflammable" in the following way: truants often give an optical illusion as to where they are: the parents think the child is at school and the school thinks they are at home, but they are in neither place.

School refusers, however, just like truants, give an illusion that they are at home from the school's perspective, and the chances are, that is where they are. I say "better" because truants are more likely to lie about where they are while school refusers are more likely to tell the truth if they can.

[George 1978]

I don't think the NUS is the right organisation to represent school children. I'm thinking more along the lines of a union for parents. The closest thing at the moment is Mumsnet, but it lacks any official authority when dealing with schools and the DfE.

I do think that the age range need to be well-represented.

[Arran]

I don't think the NUS is the right organisation to represent school children. I'm thinking more along the lines of a union for parents. The closest thing at the moment is Mumsnet, but it lacks any official authority when dealing with schools and the DfE.

[George 1978]

Perhaps the National Union of Students should extend to school pupils? After all, we (as pupils) were referred to in comprehensive school as "students". which I thought sounded grown-up and welcoming. On the other hand, the phrase "student teacher", i.e. someone who comes in for one term (usually the spring term) to give a member of teaching staff a few more free periods on the school timetable, does sound like an oxymoron in that respect.

Being a school pupil was just like doing community service - all work and no pay...

[Arran]

I am thinking about all these people in industry that are striking at the moment - postal workers (hardly any Christmas cards delivered as a result); bus drivers; ambulance workers; council workers, etc, it made me think that as pupils at school, we didn't have a trade union to contact if anything was wrong - we had to like it or lump it, and the teachers could often be as bad as the pupils.

Yes, teachers had the NUT, NASUWT, NAHT and all that, but what did we have when we were being bullied, had difficulties with lessons, peer groups, teachers, etc? Even university students have the NUS, but pupils didn't have anything - teachers got paid, pupils didn't, and the school that we went to was just as much ours as it was theirs. It was always "them and us" most of the time. Even reaching one's 18th birthday doesn't put a lot right - sometimes it can follow you throughout one's adult life.

You make a good point.

Many years ago I often thought about why there are unions for teachers but not unions for parents, or even schoolchildren.

Teaching unions represent the interests of teachers. They don't care about the interests of children or parents who are inconvenienced by strikes etc.

There have been times when teachers who go out of their way to help children with SEN, or those who are bullied, run afoul of union policy relating to matters like working hours. There isn't much that parents can do about this if their children need extra help and support and nothing official is available.

A friend of mine actually knew the meaning of "work to rule" at the tender age of 6 because of this.

[beccabear67]

My problems with school from early on and much later was I would get reports about more being "expected of me". After the measles my eyes were effected and I couldn't read the blackboard well and I was often sick with anything going around, plus missed morning as I'd get nosebleeds at night, but although eventually I got specs (the last of four kids who got the measles bad) and iron pills I still saw reports on my being a disappointment more often that not.

[Victoria O'Keefe]

Class consciousness has declined a lot. Especially here in Australia. In Britain and Australia, modern working class voters, especially Anglo males, are turning to right wing populists, while affluent areas are turning Labour - For example, Kensington.

[beccabear67]

I just watched the 1968 film If... with Malcolm McDowell as a public/military school student who leads an armed insurrection (against Arthur Lowe and Graham Crowden among others) from being abused by teachers etc. although not sure how much was fantasy, there seemed to be sudden swerves into extreme things happening, although the whole thing was obviously fiction. Still... very prophetic I suppose given school shootings that have dotted the news over the years since... but more in the U.S. where supposedly the class system isn't so entrenched (ha).

[George 1978]

I am thinking about all these people in industry that are striking at the moment - postal workers (hardly any Christmas cards delivered as a result); bus drivers; ambulance workers; council workers, etc, it made me think that as pupils at school, we didn't have a trade union to contact if anything was wrong - we had to like it or lump it, and the teachers could often be as bad as the pupils.

Yes, teachers had the NUT, NASUWT, NAHT and all that, but what did we have when we were being bullied, had difficulties with lessons, peer groups, teachers, etc? Even university students have the NUS, but pupils didn't have anything - teachers got paid, pupils didn't, and the school that we went to was just as much ours as it was theirs. It was always "them and us" most of the time. Even reaching one's 18th birthday doesn't put a lot right - sometimes it can follow you throughout one's adult life.

[Victoria O'Keefe]

it was Wilks that posed in fishnets:

[George 1978]

Yes, Bland posed for Penthouse in around 1987, wearing something on her legs that one would more likely use for fishing with.

[Victoria O'Keefe]

You know what i mean though. Paula Ann Bland and Melissa Wilks off Grange Hill both posed for lad's mags.

[George 1978]

I did a portfolio myself a few years back - whether they would have been interested in that would have been anyone's guess. The sexist society that we all live in...

[Victoria O'Keefe]

Yeah. It means i'd rather have a body that didn't get me a hell of a lot of male attention that i don't want.
I'm kind of sick of people suggesting i send in a portfolio to a lads mag etc. as well.

[George 1978]

What's the Itty Bitty Titty Club?

On second thoughts, I think I do know...