The Riots.

Its been disgusting isn't it?

Its endemic of the 'me' culture we now have sadly where the dregs of society have no pride in themselves nor the ability nor willpower to go to school, do well and get a good job and be an upstanding citizen. Instead they go to school and do nothing, caused trouble and got chucked out now arguing that 'theres noffink 4 me' and 'they don't understand me' etc...pathetic.

The 68 yr old man murdered for trying to put out flames during the riots reeks of this. The Malayan boy mugged by faux 'Good Samaritans is also a prime example....

What happened? When, where and why did it all go wrong? Labour created this impunity culture where youth get away with murder-literally now. We cannot hit our kids to sort them out, the Police cannot do their job properly because if they had we'd have the media decrying them as 'heavy handed' like the G7 protests in which one man died and now an Officer faces manslaughter-true in that instance the Officer should have seen he was harmlessly walking by-I cannot defend that but you get what I mean there....

We need tougher laws sadly. Britain is sadly a softer touch compared to other countries. This could have all been prevented if the London Police had sorted it out there and then-instead the soft approach lead to social media being used and young disgusting louts out for trouble and anything they could grab reeked havoc-like an infection.

I am sick of liberals like the ones I saw on Question Time last night and sadly the Black Community and its Youth Workers asking for 'understanding and tolerance' for youths who aren't going to get anywhere in society as they have no education and cannot get a job. Its not racism, not on my account stating these hard facts but its down to these sorts of runts irrespective of colour actually to realise RIGHT from WRONG. Their parents in some cases are also to blame. No one forces a kid to look up to a gangster on a rubbishy housing estate in a bad area, its up to them to join in or not. Anyone with half a brain would go to school and do the best they can and work forward from there....not so as it seems and then the rest of society including the Police is apparently to blame. Not once have these louts taken account of their own actions.

What is eerie is that once in the 1970's the boys comic 'ACTION' was finally brought down as 'The SEVEN PENNY NIGHTMARE' for one of its stories-I think it was called 'Mob Rule' and the cover made the headlines when a group of kids were seen rioting, an adult on the ground with a child stood over him menacing the cowering man and of all things...a Police helmet strewn in the foreground. Mary Whitehouse ranted and raved over the comic and true at the time it was an overreaction on the part of the puritanical Right in society but its chilling how a comic cover like that has now become sadly empirical fact.

What we need is a Govt with the balls to put the UK and its ills in order first. We need more Police and they need to be able to enforce the law with the impugnity they deserve-not worry over 'harming law breakers'. We need a legal system in place that punishes properly and then we will have a society that will fear the repercussions. We also need to make the youth of today learn to respect their elders once more and if louts waste their time in school they should be made to work-even in the worst jobs society has rather than let them idle their time and fall into a life of crime....

I don't know, it all disgusts me. In short I remember a time when people had manners, when young people respected the elderly, when neighbours were more friendly and people instilled the values of the War Generation onto the young growning up. I remember when parents would give their kids a good hiding to sort them out, when Coppers were to be feared on the Beat...I remember these things its high time things were redressed.

[vanhelsing]

Re: The Riots.

Don't know about you but I'd feel safer with the likes of Judge Dredd on the streets (but handing out instant justice and proper sentences for proper crimes).
Hey, I'd like to see:-
Rogue Trooper
Slaine
Judge Dredd
Nemesis the Warlock
teamed up together.

[HG]

Re: The Riots.

I think what is clear from the riots there is a lack of respect and responsibility from parts of society, not just kids but parents too.

There was a father on tv last night saying he couldn't stop his son going out and joining in the riots, of course he could if he really wanted. Then there was the 14 year old girl who turned who turned up at court today by herself and the judge had to send for her parents to attend, unbelieveable couldn't give a damn attitude from the parent(s).

As for justice, those convicted of less serious crimes should be put to work clearing up their communities rather than being given fines or small prison sentences which will achieve nothing.

The police have an impossible job, too soft if you listen to right wing commentators and too brutal/racist if you listen to the left, how they hit the middle ground I don't know.

[vanhelsing]

Re: The Riots.

I remember the Moss Side Riots as I live near there.
Anyway, I don't know why it's onl;y rioters who're:-
unemployed (I wonder t]where the media ghot the idea that it was mostly unemployed people involved from)
On benefits
and live on council estates
that were rioting and looting and why it's only the rioters and looters that should lose their houses.
This is typical ignorance by ungrateful politicians who expected the rioters and looters to vote for them and journalists.

[sf1378]

Re: The Riots.

Don't know about you but I'd feel safer with the likes of Judge Dredd on the streets (but handing out instant justice and proper sentences for proper crimes).
Hey, I'd like to see:-
Rogue Trooper
Slaine
Judge Dredd
Nemesis the Warlock
teamed up together.

Lol. Dredd circa the 1970's iteration, Rogue from the early 80s! Slaine? Don't know mucho about him but know of his BESERK-FURY!!! Imagine SLAINE RIOT POLICE EN MASSE!!!

[stuckinthe80's]

Re: The Riots.

I remember the Moss Side Riots as I live near there.
Anyway, I don't know why it's onl;y rioters who're:-
unemployed (I wonder t]where the media ghot the idea that it was mostly unemployed people involved from)
On benefits
and live on council estates
that were rioting and looting and why it's only the rioters and looters that should lose their houses.
This is typical ignorance by ungrateful politicians who expected the rioters and looters to vote for them and journalists.

Why is it ignorance on the politicians behalf? They didn't make the wasters loot hard working people's shops and set fire to their businesses. It's a total disgrace. It's matterless what the rioters background or race is. The fact is they need to be punished and made an example of. Far too many people think the world owes them a living and they can just take what they want. Lock them up or make them do hard labour to clean the mess they made up.

[sf1378]

Re: The Riots.

I think what is clear from the riots there is a lack of respect and responsibility from parts of society, not just kids but parents too.

There was a father on tv last night saying he couldn't stop his son going out and joining in the riots, of course he could if he really wanted. Then there was the 14 year old girl who turned who turned up at court today by herself and the judge had to send for her parents to attend, unbelieveable cou;dn't give a damn attitude from the parent(s).

As for justice, those convicted of less serious crimes should be put to work clearing up their communities rather than being given fines or small prison sentences which will achieve nothing.

The police have an impossible job, too soft if you listen to right wing commentators and too brutal/racist if you listen to the left, how they hit the middle ground I don't know.

Well said.

I think people who DO have a good education, good parents with a sense of social responsibility then people like you or I will make statements logically like this. Those that aren't of 'our ilk' do what has been done this past week. What amazed me is the opportunists who are employed like the chef, teaching assistant etc who 'joined in'....its opportunism.

At the moment, I've got BBC3 on-I'd live paused it-so its on delay playback and its 'Riots: Young Voters Question Time'. I think the State could create a great Education System, imagine Comprehensive Schools across the land where education is first rate BUT IT IS UP TO THE YOUTH to WANT TO LEARN: academically as well as be good citizens.

What makes me SICK is hearing stupid young people moaning about 'how we are misunderstood, we don't have opportunities'; one young boy has just made mention of having good values-he described it as 'an amalgamation of what his Mum taught him, his community taught him'-he said he has 'respect for his community'.

The disgusting thing is frankly a lot of Black British moan on such programmes about 'not having things done for them'-again, is that a racialist steryotype from me? I am Asian, my parents came over from Sri Lanka in 1971 and I am not timid of speaking my mind over these sorts of issues. The reason I have NO SYMPATHY whatsoever for those that rioted and the excuse that their looting, wreaking havoc, arson etc because I take my Father as inspiration:

He grew up in Sri Lanka. His Mother died aged 35. His Father was an adulterer who hated him for no apparent reason and forced him to leave school at 14 and get a job to help HIM support his siblings or 'get out'. My Father didn't have toys, he had to walk 6 miles to school barefoot there and back. His lunch if one can call that was a peppermint and a glass of water. He didn't have proper clothes and didn't get his first pair of shoes until he was 16 but only got to wear a nice pair of shoes when he started earning properly at the age of 18 OFF HIS OWN BAT. He didn't have 'role models'. He saw drug taking, he was offered it, he chose not to do such things. He used to be made to work as a hod carrier and cement mixer for his Father who was a builder from the age of 11 during the Summer Holidays from school. And he didn't see a penny at that age for doing that work. His hands he'd tell me 'would crack' from the vicious Lime that had been used back then in cement....

So, why tell all this? Well, if HE can survive all that suffering, have no childhood really, use his mind and willpower to traverse life, to eventually get married, come to THIS country, have my sister, own a house within a YEAR of her birth and then have me what the bloody hell is wrong with the selfish, moaning, gutter trash that went rioting, looting etc this past week? They were ALL born here predominantly. Why should the Govt spoon feed ungrateful types like that who haven't got off their backsides and made something of themselves? Its disgusting that they all seem to 'blame' other issues in society for their own faults. Frankly I wish they could all have been rounded up-and shot.

Its down to individuals to become good people-NOT central Govt. Govt is there to provide infrastructure, security etc. Not spoon feed idiots and provide them everything and yet they have the impugnity to get away with anything. Parents also need to instil good values and also parents need to take back the right to control their children without fear of being arrested for slapping them for falling out of line.

The youth of the UK is disgusting on the whole thesedays.

[Marine Boy]

Re: The Riots.

I have been as apalled as anyone at the rioting and looting. It's unfathomable the way so many youths behaved and the lack of respect for their community they all seemed to have. But I do keep thinking of all those young people, especially in the affected areas, who look at the pictures and are scared that just because of their age, they may be tarred with the same brush. I don't know the figures, but I imagine rioters and looters account for a very small percentage of communities. That's not to suggest for one minute that the situation is any less dreadful. Proper justice for what has happened is imperitive.

I was a little unsure about the last paragraph in your first post, sf1378. You seem to be talking about a kind of golden age which I'm not certain ever existed. Neither am I convinced that parents hitting their children more often or kids being frightened of policeman are really going to be the answer.

I think the youth of the UK are generally not the kind of youth we've seen rioting on the streets in the past few days.

[Richard1978]

Re: The Riots.

I think the youth of the UK are generally not the kind of youth we've seen rioting on the streets in the past few days.

It seems the right-wing press always are quick to blame anyone not white, middle class & over 35 for all problems in life.

[sf1378]

Re: The Riots.

I wonder myself...I think the parents who are 'scummy' for want of a better word, or those that don't discipline their kids in any way at all are also to blame. I think the riots basically showed that there are people-of all ages and walks of life-sadly without morality and pride to do the right thing.

I don't think there was ever a 'golden age' Marine Boy but it was never as bad as this, it seems people went to cause damage for the sake of it and loot because they saw others do it also. Its just that we never had things like this occur before. The right wing press will blame the non-white non-English as usual yes, but having seen the way young Blacks in particular bemoan this that and the other I'm not surprised.

Statistically, Operation Trident has been targeting Blacks because nearly all gun and knife crime especially in London in the areas like Tottenham etc that had the riots in particular these crimes including gang warfare has been....Black on Black. I've not really ever been stopped by Coppers but if I were I usually comply, be polite, job done, on my way...these idiots-all colours I will say-get all argumentative and then it degenerates into possible arrest for a while at a Police Station, usually because they swear at the Officer...they have no brain really.

Last nights Young Question Time was supposed to be focused on the riots but it degenerated into a steryotypical shouting match that Richard Bacon really had to enforce and control-the Black British youth bemoaned the Govt for 'not doing enough', 'no opportunities' etc-I MEAN, COME ON?! They were born here, they live in a country where education is accessible to all, they live in comparatively nice houses with what seems to be a democratic infrastructure and the ability to earn and buy what they want...instead of which they help reinforce their own negative steryotypes by swaggering about, having 'at IT TUUDE' and 'ARSK-in' for this that and the other...So what if some lowlife is on their estate driving a big car and has money from ill gotten gain-they don't have to join in do they???? No, these riots were NOT about race at all but about lazy disgusting dregs in society that expect the world to do everything for them. But then, such a description can be given to any race on any estate in a poorer part of the country-you don't have to join in and bemoan things at all. They act like they know everything these days so common sense should be apparent in them-but isn't. They seem to have created their own crosses to bear and then get angry at bigger society, the middle classes and the Govt when things go wrong....

I don't know what can be done to 'change' things really.

[Sly]

Re: The Riots.

I'd love to sit down with your dad and have a chat with him sf1378. He sounds awesome.

As for the riots. It's the beginnings of a class that has developed because of lazy parenting and bad decisions regarding benefits. There used to be three class. Upper class. Middle class. Working class. What we have now is "Scrounger" class. The parents parents lived off the state, so their kids did and went on to have kids of their own. It's these kids that see their mum and grandparents get everything handed to them on a plate since they were born. It may not be the most lavish lifestyle but you can certainly live comfortable on it as you can see many of these people doing.

When I was young I had bugger all really. A lot of my clothes were made by my Mum and I never had crazy expensive toys or exuberant holidays. My Dad worked all his life for a reasonable wage considering, but he never had the money to go throwing about. When you compare this to my friends who were not in a family that worked, they had the the best of everything. I recall telling my Mum and Dad about spending time around their house and my parents getting really quite angry over the whole thing, simply because was pulling 60 hour weeks and couldn't provide as much as the Government was providing them. Fast forward 20 odd years and I have a successful well paid job while my friends either live off the state or in some worse cases are spending time in prison.

They complain that they have nothing. One in particular (who happens to be family) complains he has nothing when I play him on Xbox LIVE, yet he has a new game pretty much every week, while I, even with my good job, cannot afford to do that. He complains that's he is bored all the time, and cannot get a job because he didn't pay attention at school. Which quite frankly is BS, I live in a big city where you can pick up a job within a few week of trying. He simply doesn't want it because of the way it works now he gets more disposable cash to spend on smokes, drink and 360 games. On top of that he gets all the free time he wants to enjoy them all. He wants everything for minimum effort, like the rioters, if he can get it he will.

This is the Under class the UK has created. The Under class that's responsible for a lot of the UK's declining school standards, the Under class that's responsible for run down council estates, the Under class that is responsible for the immigrant workforce we have in the UK and the Under class that drains the UK's finances without putting anything back in.

It's a constant loop of free housing, free milk, free school dinners, free bus fare, free dentists and opticians, free prescriptions and free further education until more kids are spit out into this churning circle that they are likely never to get out of, simply because the motivation and belief that they can do something for themselves. It's sad when you see a kid in a pushchair outside Greggs bakery with a muckied face that you know will never amount to anything, simply because of the way it is brought up. In many cases the child is just a paycheck for it's slovenly creator.

Before anyone jumps in I'm not having a go at anyone who uses the benefits system in the UK as a stopgap. I myself have been on both Job Seekers and the sick and it has been a life saver. It's there as a safety net, not as a living. It is time this wastrels are taught that.

[vanhelsing]

Re: The Riots.

I've not really ever been stopped by Coppers but if I were I usually comply, be polite, job done, on my way...these idiots-all colours I will say-get all argumentative and then it degenerates into possible arrest for a while at a Police Station, usually because they swear at the Officer...they have no brain really.

That's the best thing to do. Co-operate as bringing ethnicinity and kicking off about it's only going to make thimgs worse. I was stopped by a couple of copperrs recently (thats the thanks I get for lending my lat trolley token to a customer) because I was seen hanging around outside the shop. I co-operated, told them they could search me andf there was no trouble.

[sf1378]

Re: The Riots.

Cheers for your comment about my Father Sly. Unfortunately he has emphasema and also suffers from other health problems due to loosing my Mum, like low sodium levels causing confusion, tiredness, breathlessness and extreme loss of weight, hes not the man he once was but I'm sure when he was in his prime you'd have enjoyed conversing. Oh how I wish he were healthly, I could do with his advice sometimes-as well as the company...such is life.

I also agree with all the points you made.

[ncpcov]

Re: The Riots.

I always maintain this boils down to one thing - RESPECT.
Kids have no respect for parents, teachers, police, employers, property.
As has been said - when I was growing up I knew fine well if I were to smash a neighbours window, bunk off school, talk back to a teacher - I would get grounded, clip round the ear, etc off my mum.
I would not as seems to be the case nowadays - get either of my parents walking down the school and attacking the teacher, fighting with neighbours, etc - because kids dont seem to be able to do anything wrong.
This whole "woe is me" they don't understand us. Yes you are right - we don't understand why -
You feel the world owes you a living?
You should have expensive designer gear and iPhones without grafting really hard for these luxury items? (I only just got a large LCD TV a few years ago - after working many hours overtime - I earned it!)
You cannot treat others with respect? (Manners anyone? Hello - where are they)
You cannot respect others property? (kids attacking people for telling them to stop sitting on their cars)

The most ironic thing about this - these "poverty stricken" louts - are arranging this on social media on their £400 iPhones and Blackberrys!!??!? Oh what it means to be poor...