Christmas When You Were Growing Up

[Arran]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

Is Christmas still a religious celebration? It was in 1800 but by 1900 it had started to become commercialised and take on customs that were unrecognisable in 1800. I can remember learning about Christmas past at primary school.

In the 17th century Christmas was banned in England by the Puritans because they thought it was a decadent Catholic celebration that early Christians did not recognise. In Scotland the Presbyterian Church once discouraged people from celebrating Christmas and did not recognise it as an official Christian celebration.

[George 1978]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

Is Christmas still a religious celebration?

I hope that no one from the Church of England has read that! Any vicars or clergymen on here please feel free to officially answer! I am a bit surprised that such an obvious question has been asked!

We still have the Midnight Mass and the Christmas morning service on BBC 1 each year - churches have Christmas morning services, etc. I think that Christmas will always be a religious celebration for a long time to come, hence the fact that it is still celebrated - the commercial side of things have sidelined things certainly in the past 50 years or so. When I was younger (as a six year old back in 1984 for example), my first thought of Christmas was receiving presents and having new toys to play with, rather than the thought of the birth of Jesus - the Nativity play which is performed in Primary schools is a reminder of the religious side of things - that and the carol services are there as reminder to youngsters that it is not all a "bargain basement" fest.

As an adult, (and I am talking personally here in a way), we think of having a sip of sherry from a pony glass and a few After Eight mints as soon as midnight arrives, and wondering whether we will be sober enough to get to the nearest DFS on Boxing Day and buy that sofa which was advertised during the commercial break of Coronation Street. Christmas means different things to people of different ages (and often different generations as well). In true Mr Bean style, I tried to retain the child's aspect of Christmas for myself when I got older, but I think that it is nostalgia doing that rather than keep traditions alive.

Also, which side would you think that Father Christmas would take on this? Would he represent the religious side because of the traditional aspects of the character, or would be on the commercial side - after all, as we have mentioned earlier on, his red coat was as a result of Coca-Cola's advertising, and also the fact that he delivers presents to children in the middle of the night - he seems to be very much of a consumer person considering that he appears in advertisements, gives children Mars branded chocolate etc - perhaps he should be an employee of Tesco or WHSmith rather than the Church of England? He may represent the role as "postman" because of that - after all, what is religious about delivering parcels?

Another point is that in this country at least, Jewish and Muslim festivals are understandably not celebrated like that, although Hindus do a great Diwali celebration when it comes around each year. I know that there are still people and families who think of Christmas as a religious from the outset.

[staffslad]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

Like it or not, I think Black Friday/Cyber Monday is here to stay. I agree that we don't want to see the chaos that sometimes occurs in the US being duplicated here in the UK. Personally, I would not go out shopping on those days, but I have made purchases online, mainly for Christmas presents. I do think that there are genuine sales out there, but of course it always pays to keep your head screwed on. I saved between 30% and 50% on the items I bought, but I want to stress that these were gifts that I would have had to buy anyway; I would not spend on Black Friday just for the sake of spending.

Yes, online shopping is seriously denting many high street shops sales nowadays. Although I don't like to see shops close and people lose their jobs, I can't really see what can be done about it. If people prefer to sit at home and shop online, then that is what they will do. It's just how shopping is evolving.

[George 1978]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

I believe that Woolworths and MFI were victims of that sort of thing ten years ago - in their 1970s and 1980s heyday they were very strong on the High Street with Christmas advertising and sales - nearly everyone got their baubles and Christmas fairy lights from Woolworths (Woolco). Online shopping has given that an extra dimension in which some can't quite keep up with. How many times have we heard of "Acme Stores Limited goes into administration" in news reports? With the Credit Crunch of ten years ago we heard of it several times in a week.

I saw this cartoon in Private Eye a couple of months ago, showing how methods of shopping has changed in the past 20 years - in 1998, the caption was "they've got a website", where in 2018, it was "they're got a High Street store".

I use Tesco for online shopping, only because there isn't a big store in the area I live in - I believe that Tesco will be the survivors in all of this. Look at the Sainsbury's - Asda proposed merger from earlier on this year which has seemed to have cooled down as if late. There is an Asda and a Sainsbury's so close to where I live, and it would be interesting which one would close if the merger or takeover goes ahead.

[Arran]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

I hope that no one from the Church of England has read that! Any vicars or clergymen on here please feel free to officially answer! I am a bit surprised that such an obvious question has been asked!

We still have the Midnight Mass and the Christmas morning service on BBC 1 each year - churches have Christmas morning services, etc. I think that Christmas will always be a religious celebration for a long time to come, hence the fact that it is still celebrated - the commercial side of things have sidelined things certainly in the past 50 years or so. When I was younger (as a six year old back in 1984 for example), my first thought of Christmas was receiving presents and having new toys to play with, rather than the thought of the birth of Jesus - the Nativity play which is performed in Primary schools is a reminder of the religious side of things - that and the carol services are there as reminder to youngsters that it is not all a "bargain basement" fest.

As an adult, (and I am talking personally here in a way), we think of having a sip of sherry from a pony glass and a few After Eight mints as soon as midnight arrives, and wondering whether we will be sober enough to get to the nearest DFS on Boxing Day and buy that sofa which was advertised during the commercial break of Coronation Street. Christmas means different things to people of different ages (and often different generations as well). In true Mr Bean style, I tried to retain the child's aspect of Christmas for myself when I got older, but I think that it is nostalgia doing that rather than keep traditions alive.

Also, which side would you think that Father Christmas would take on this? Would he represent the religious side because of the traditional aspects of the character, or would be on the commercial side - after all, as we have mentioned earlier on, his red coat was as a result of Coca-Cola's advertising, and also the fact that he delivers presents to children in the middle of the night - he seems to be very much of a consumer person considering that he appears in advertisements, gives children Mars branded chocolate etc - perhaps he should be an employee of Tesco or WHSmith rather than the Church of England? He may represent the role as "postman" because of that - after all, what is religious about delivering parcels?

Another point is that in this country at least, Jewish and Muslim festivals are understandably not celebrated like that, although Hindus do a great Diwali celebration when it comes around each year. I know that there are still people and families who think of Christmas as a religious from the outset.

It's a bit more complicated than this.

At one end of the scale are Christians who do not celebrate Christmas - they are few in number but they do exist. Next are Christians who celebrate Christmas but don't do the commercial side of it or Father Christmas because they see it as an innovation not in the Bible. Father Christmas would have been unrecognised in Britain in 1800 as the custom appeared some time in the mid 19th century when kids would hang up a sock then find an orange inside it on Christmas morning. At the opposite end of the scale are staunch atheists who celebrate Christmas as one big decadent party and do the Father Christmas malarkey simply because it's fun or they see it as a national celebration rather than a religious celebration.

Did you know that the UK is one of a small number of countries that does not have a national day. Therefore Christmas probably substitutes it for millions of people who aren't religious.

[staffslad]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

The Woolworth's Christmas advert was something eagerly anticipated and was an indication that the big day was fast approaching.

I think some of the bigger chains are now experiencing a similar effect to what small, independent shops went through several decades ago. Back then, there was a move away from shopping at individual shops like a butcher, baker etc, to doing much more of your purchases under a single roof, be that in a store like Tesco or an out of town mall. Consequently, many small high street shops suffered and were forced to close. Well, I think the same is happening again and has been gradually underway for a long time, but is accelerating. Online retailers are affecting purchases from stores in an increasingly adverse way. We have seen some well known casualties and there will be more. Those that can adapt have a good chance of surviving, probably with a smaller physical store footprint, but those that cannot will find difficult times ahead.

[Arran]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

This is the first Christmas without Toys R Us since 1984.

[George 1978]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

It's a bit more complicated than this.

At one end of the scale are Christians who do not celebrate Christmas - they are few in number but they do exist. Next are Christians who celebrate Christmas but don't do the commercial side of it or Father Christmas because they see it as an innovation not in the Bible. Father Christmas would have been unrecognised in Britain in 1800 as the custom appeared some time in the mid 19th century when kids would hang up a sock then find an orange inside it on Christmas morning. At the opposite end of the scale are staunch atheists who celebrate Christmas as one big decadent party and do the Father Christmas malarkey simply because it's fun or they see it as a national celebration rather than a religious celebration.

Did you know that the UK is one of a small number of countries that does not have a national day. Therefore Christmas probably substitutes it for millions of people who aren't religious.

Seems strange to think that they are Christians who don't celebrate Christmas - I would assume that one would most likely to be a non-Christian who would celebrate the event. There is also the Orthodox Christmas which is on 7th January, which was on that date due to the change from the Julian to the Gregorian calendar (or perhaps the other way round).

It just proves however that those people don't see it as a religious thing as a lot of people do, hence the relatively recent commercialism. I am certain that people (usually children) still hang up a sock each year and expect one or two things delivered inside it.

I do know that Great Britain does not have a national day, along with Denmark - I would like to see this country have its own day - perhaps 23rd April when it is St George's Day (although Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales would argue for their own national day as well). The Queen's Official Birthday (even though the actual date changed each year) could also be a candidate as well.

[George 1978]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

It's nice that Tesco are reusing their "Everyone's Welcome" slogan from last year - when I saw the adverts on the TV and that slogan was used, I always think to myself: "yes, everyone's welcome at Tesco except shoplifters".

[tex]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

It's nice that Tesco are reusing their "Everyone's Welcome" slogan from last year - when I saw the adverts on the TV and that slogan was used, I always think to myself: "yes, everyone's welcome at Tesco except shoplifters".

Interesting also to note that waitrose are now part of the John lewis group but they used there christmas ad to poo poo the Elton john ad?

[George 1978]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

They should have called the advertising campaign Elton John Lewis.

All I can say now is that I have posted most of my Christmas cards (feeding the post boxes as I call it), although there will always be the odd person that I have forgotten.

[tex]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

They should have called the advertising campaign Elton John Lewis.

All I can say now is that I have posted most of my Christmas cards (feeding the post boxes as I call it), although there will always be the odd person that I have forgotten.

Commendable George, i really must start writing my two cards soon!

[George 1978]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

Commendable George, i really must start writing my two cards soon!

You do that, but don't leave it too late.

Final Posting Dates:

Tuesday 18th December 2018 - UK Second Class
Thursday 20th December 2018 - UK First Class

Tuesday 4th December 2018 - Africa and the Middle East
Monday 10th December 2018 - Australia and New Zealand
Friday 14th December 2018 - United States and Canada
Saturday 15th December 2018 - Sweden and Finland
Monday 17th December 2018 - Some mainland Europe countries
Tuesday 18th December 2018 - Ireland, France and Belgium (and I assume the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands as well).

https://www.royalmail.com/christmas/last-posting-dates/

I posted my international ones (two for the United States and one for Australia) over a week ago, giving them a head start for obvious reasons.

[tex]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

George, your scaring me.

[Zincubus]

Re: Christmas When You Were Growing Up

George, your scaring me.

He's fine ....

We are both Aspergers and as such experience life slightly differently to you normal folk


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro