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The ITV network map from 1978

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  • #16
    Re: The ITV network map from 1978

    Originally posted by beccabear67 View Post
    One thing I am still a bit fuzzy about, more so than transmitter overlaps and atmospherically bounced signals, is: how did the BBC in say Newcastle differ from say what was on the air in St. Albans, or way up in Glasgow? I've seen how some BBC programs were/are made by BBC Cymru/Wales and BBC Scotland... do they all get shown U.K.-wide by the beeb?
    Apart from regional news, Inside Out, and the regional segment of Sunday Politics, there wouldn't be any difference between Newcastle-upon-Tyne and St Albans - the former would be served by Look North (a different news programme to what serves most of Yorkshire, and also Lincolnshire and Humberside), and the latter would almost be served by London, (although Look East might be also available to residents in that area as well). However, Scotland has its own continuity and extra programmes, usually after the Ten O'clock News in addition to Reporting Scotland. I have Sky Digital and so therefore I can receive all he different BBC 1 regions.

    A lot of programmes made by BBC Wales are seen on BBC 1 and BBC 2 are seen within Wales, while Welsh language programmes are seen on S4C - a Wales only, Welsh language television channel seen in lieu of Channel 4.

    Originally posted by beccabear67 View Post
    Were there programs made that weren't necessarily regional but shown only in one, or some areas by the BBC but not others, just as with ITV? I'm sorry if it seems funny to be more ignorant about the big licensed provider more than the old regional ITV.
    Not all programmes are shown regionally are not necessarily about the area in question - in the 1970s and 1980s, a lot of imported series were shown regionally on ITV as it was not made by one of the ITV companies and so the scheduling had a "no overall control" in the schedules. On ITV, a programme on a national issue could be seen regionally, while on BBC 1 a regional themed programme could be seen nationally.

    Originally posted by beccabear67 View Post
    I have some published material about the histories of Granada, ATV/Central, and Tyne Tees... and some about the entire ITV system, I think the one I found out about for Yorkshire is a bit pricey as an out of print book or I'd have that as well. The one on Granada has a lot on the various franchise changes and amalgamations though. I know the least about Border, Grampian, and Scottish.
    Each ITV company is different and has a different way of doing things - this has got to do with several factors: A) The size of the company - small companies made fewer programmes for the network as they had limited resources; B) The area of the company - London, the Midlands and the North West have a higher population and so it generates greater advertising revenue, hence more programmes on the network, and also the fact that the south is more lucrative than the north; and C) the different attitudes that each company has - when Granada started up in the mid 1950s, they were a company which specified in cinemas and leisure, and television was just one arm of its empire, similar to Rediffusion and ABC.
    Telling it almost exactly like it was so many years later - and proud of doing so!

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    • #17
      Re: The ITV network map from 1978

      Originally posted by beccabear67 View Post
      I wanted to add that I see opt outs are mentioned, and it sounds like there were London made BBC programs not shown by BBC Cymru/Wales at all, correct? And if I have got anything confused please correct me.
      Most programmes were seen on BBC 1 in Wales, and Wales only missed out on repeats which the main BBC 1 had shown - programmes made in England are more likely to be seen in Wales rather than the other way round.
      Telling it almost exactly like it was so many years later - and proud of doing so!

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      • #18
        Re: The ITV network map from 1978

        On the subject of regional BBC, it was never my thing.

        I was from an ‘ITV viewing family’ which is probably worth a separate thread by itself :-) so as a teen, my interest was regional ITV as it was so diverse and varied to the BBC, which by and large, was the same programming, except for the local news and some occasional regional programmes.

        But I do remember in the mid-80s in Felixstowe, receiving TVS via the Dover transmitter and I found the BBC1 local news programme (for Kent?) was called London Plus, so I assumed local news for the BBC meant London and the whole South East.

        And I remember London Plus being very different to BBC Look East or BBC Look North, which I was more used to. Not just because the news was different (London-centric), but the opening titles were ‘jazzier’ - I found a clip on YouTube with a younger Jeremy Paxman as presenter:

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVsgE6PsGbo

        ITV also used to show a lot of imported American TV shows, which I loved, and each ITV region might have different episodes on at different times. This meant for those lucky enough to receive more than one ITV station, you could watch say ‘Benson’ or the ‘A Team’ etc, twice a day or more, different episodes sometimes, it was like having additional TV channels, and that was a big deal to me in the 80s.

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        • #19
          Re: The ITV network map from 1978

          Originally posted by George 1978 View Post
          How many of us who didn't live in Cornwall, Devon, Somerset, Dorset, or the Isles of Scilly wondered who or what Gus Honeybun was?
          Yeah, I well remember Gus Honeybun on TSW at teatime. I had some pals at Plymouth Poly in the late 80s, and there was a thing for students to write in and get Gus to jump up and down on his 'magic mushroom' which amused us no end :-)

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          • #20
            Re: The ITV network map from 1978

            Thanks for the extra info. I think I have a fairly intricate grip on ITV and Channel 4 but there were some things about the BBC I wasn't sure about... until now, thank you! Imagine if there'd ever been offshore pirate tv like there was radio for awhile for another layer? I think the U.K. had a very unique system which evolved and led to a lot of great programs being created and realize that a lot of this was lost through mergers and simplification. De-regionalization is like one size fits all and I'm glad if there are still some differences.

            When I think of imports I seem to first think of things like The Singing Ringing Tree, The Magic Roundabout and Hector's House! Other than those, on DVD I have Babylon Berlin the German series aired on Sky, but I'm sure I'm missing out on a lot. Oh, I did see some of the original Humans sci-fi series in Swedish with subtitles, but then they remade it with English actors and I was happy to stop squinting to read.

            I suppose the Australian shows are imports, but I don't really think of them that way. Of course some of them are co-productions.
            Last edited by beccabear67; 04-12-2019, 18:45.
            My virtual jigsaws: https://www.jigsawplanet.com/beccabear67/Original-photo-puzzles

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            • #21
              Re: The ITV network map from 1978

              When my Aunt & Uncle lived in semi-rural Lincolnshire it was possible to pick up 3 different regions depending on which you pointed the aerial, Yorkshire, Anglia or East Midlands.

              When BBC2 last showed Star Trek on a Sunday morning some regions opted out to screen The Super League Show.
              The Trickster On The Roof

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              • #22
                Re: The ITV network map from 1978

                Originally posted by Pensky View Post
                I was from an ‘ITV viewing family’ which is probably worth a separate thread by itself :-) so as a teen, my interest was regional ITV as it was so diverse and varied to the BBC, which by and large, was the same programming, except for the local news and some occasional regional programmes.
                Sometimes I just wished that my family was a BBC household as it did drive up us the wall seeing the same advert a number of times in each evening - it's like watching on Christmas Day and seeing the post-Queen film, and counting how many "sale starts 10 am Boxing Day" adverts are on.

                Originally posted by Pensky View Post
                But I do remember in the mid-80s in Felixstowe, receiving TVS via the Dover transmitter and I found the BBC1 local news programme (for Kent?) was called London Plus, so I assumed local news for the BBC meant London and the whole South East.

                And I remember London Plus being very different to BBC Look East or BBC Look North, which I was more used to. Not just because the news was different (London-centric), but the opening titles were ‘jazzier’ - I found a clip on YouTube with a younger Jeremy Paxman as presenter.
                The old South East region which was in existence until 2001 and had covered everywhere from Greater London, to Kent, Thames Valley and the Home Counties, and even during the summer months they would opt into South Today, meaning that the region served was even bigger! It's surprising that this wasn't split up until 2001, and that the Thames Valley part was split into South Today's area.

                Originally posted by Pensky View Post
                TV also used to show a lot of imported American TV shows, which I loved, and each ITV region might have different episodes on at different times. This meant for those lucky enough to receive more than one ITV station, you could watch say ‘Benson’ or the ‘A Team’ etc, twice a day or more, different episodes sometimes, it was like having additional TV channels, and that was a big deal to me in the 80s.
                As I mentioned before, a lot of imported stuff such as episodes of Prisoner: Cell Block H were seen regionally as it wasn't made by any ITV company, and so it would have been a coincidence if two different regions were showing the same episodes at the same time. I used to buy so many different aerials from Argos just to try and get Yorkshire TV in Nottingham - laughable now I have Sky and can get the regions in one way or another, even though it really isn't worth it anymore for obvious reasons.
                Telling it almost exactly like it was so many years later - and proud of doing so!

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                • #23
                  Re: The ITV network map from 1978

                  Originally posted by beccabear67 View Post
                  Thanks for the extra info. I think I have a fairly intricate grip on ITV and Channel 4 but there were some things about the BBC I wasn't sure about... until now, thank you! Imagine if there'd ever been offshore pirate tv like there was radio for awhile for another layer? I think the U.K. had a very unique system which evolved and led to a lot of great programs being created and realize that a lot of this was lost through mergers and simplification. De-regionalization is like one size fits all and I'm glad if there are still some differences.
                  I believe that there was briefly a TV version of Radio Caroline in around 1970 (looking at old microfilm newspaper copies) but it didn't last long because of the authorities finding out. Reading a book which was out to mark 50 years of ITV in 2005, there were mentions that the plan was to have a sports franchise; an entertainment franchise; a drama franchise and so on - when one thinks about it, a news franchise exists because of ITN providing news to the channel.

                  Originally posted by beccabear67 View Post
                  I suppose the Australian shows are imports, but I don't really think of them that way. Of course some of them are co-productions.
                  The Australian shows are indeed imports - The Young Doctors and Sons and Daughters were two of them, although Granada's Families which was more or less scheduled in the same slot, was British made and I think it was made with the support of an Australian TV company, hence the implication of Australia in many storylines.
                  Telling it almost exactly like it was so many years later - and proud of doing so!

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                  • #24
                    Re: The ITV network map from 1978

                    Originally posted by Richard1978 View Post
                    When my Aunt & Uncle lived in semi-rural Lincolnshire it was possible to pick up 3 different regions depending on which you pointed the aerial, Yorkshire, Anglia or East Midlands.

                    When BBC2 last showed Star Trek on a Sunday morning some regions opted out to screen The Super League Show.
                    I would have liked to have lived in Lincolnshire as well and get both Central and Yorkshire. As for the Super League Show, it was the last England regional programme to be on BBC 2 and by the mid 2000s there was controversy that it was still there, and some viewers who only had digital couldn't see it if they had BBC 2 on - one even wondered why BBC 2 had different programmes on the different TV sets in their house. It did make it to BBC 1 eventually.
                    Telling it almost exactly like it was so many years later - and proud of doing so!

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                    • #25
                      Re: The ITV network map from 1978

                      I remember reading that when ITV went 24 hours they considered making the night time hours a separate national franchise

                      The potential audience & revenue from advertising was too low to make it viable.
                      The Trickster On The Roof

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                      • #26
                        Re: The ITV network map from 1978

                        Originally posted by Richard1978 View Post
                        I remember reading that when ITV went 24 hours they considered making the night time hours a separate national franchise

                        The potential audience & revenue from advertising was too low to make it viable.
                        I don't think Central would have been part of it, unless they were the main provider of the programmes to the network - they didn't show Night Network because they wanted to continue showing films in that slot, as well as continue their Jobfinder service.
                        Telling it almost exactly like it was so many years later - and proud of doing so!

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: The ITV network map from 1978

                          Originally posted by George 1978 View Post
                          I don't think Central would have been part of it, unless they were the main provider of the programmes to the network - they didn't show Night Network because they wanted to continue showing films in that slot, as well as continue their Jobfinder service.
                          That's probably the reason any ideas of a night time franchise didn't work out.

                          At the same time there was an attempt to have an overnight radio service for all the independent local stations.

                          When they started out had some big name DJs, but had trouble selling enough advertising because most of the stations in the big cities were already had overnight shows.

                          In spite of Richard Branson investing in the project & the big names being replaced by lesser DJs, it eventually proved to be unviable.
                          The Trickster On The Roof

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                          • #28
                            Re: The ITV network map from 1978

                            It wasn't until 2004 that ITV plc came into place, and in hindsight the channel was referred to as a dysfunctional family, what with one company doing completely the opposite thing to another.

                            In the mid 1990s Gem AM had something called the Overnight Express - could this be what you were referring to? I suppose that it was the shape of things to come when DJs were "voice-tracked", and non-London radio stations started to have national DJs on their local stations, almost giving the illusion that the programme was literally and exclusively coming from that radio station only, unless one can pick up more than one radio station in which that was untrue.
                            Telling it almost exactly like it was so many years later - and proud of doing so!

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                            • #29
                              Re: The ITV network map from 1978

                              Originally posted by George 1978 View Post
                              Jobfinder service.
                              This is something I'm a bit hazy on... did Central have a live show, a text bulletin board, or something else for people looking for work? I've read a lot about the CeeFax and Oracle services, was it connected to something like them?

                              I always admired how in the U.K. uses were found for television that didn't seem to get thought of in America. PBS in the U.S. did have some elementary schools programming, but I think it was always a bit unofficial. We had an Open University type of set up in Canada with our provincial versions of PBS, TV Ontario and The Knowledge Network, airing telecourses with actual higher education credits involved.
                              My virtual jigsaws: https://www.jigsawplanet.com/beccabear67/Original-photo-puzzles

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                              • #30
                                Re: The ITV network map from 1978

                                Originally posted by beccabear67 View Post
                                This is something I'm a bit hazy on... did Central have a live show, a text bulletin board, or something else for people looking for work? I've read a lot about the CeeFax and Oracle services, was it connected to something like them?
                                I think that originally it was a Ceefax-alike text service but they later used written text on a dark coloured background - obviously I was still in bed when it was on the TV and so I wouldn't have seen it back then. Other regions started to do their own Jobfinder service after that until the early 2000s.
                                Telling it almost exactly like it was so many years later - and proud of doing so!

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